Elk Hunting, talking shop with David Holder Part 1

Professional Hunting Advice

Today I am going to be talking shop with David Holder of Above the Rest Outdoors (www.abovetherestoutdoors.com) on the topic of Elk Hunting. 

 

David, here at Pantry Paratus we are interested in all things food.  And for us here in this part of the country, “going out for food” can mean a trip to the grocery store or walking into the woods with a hunting implement. 

 

For me growing up on the East Coast of the United States, getting the opportunity to bow hunt for Elk in the Rocky Mountains was something on the order of, “Yeah, I may actually get to do that once in my lifetime—someday.”  Now that I am actually fortunate enough to live here in such a beautiful place, I often wake up and think how awesome it is to see so much game right in city limits!  

 

Wilson: “Tell us about yourself, have you always lived in NW Montana?”

David Holder: “No I actually grew up outside of Washington, DC.  I moved to Great Falls, MT when I was in my twenties.  I have now been in Montana for the last 19 years.  Great Falls was the first stop.  I took a job with the fire department and that was what led me here.   I was a bow hunter in Virginia and I was kind of in the same mindset you were in that I may want to do something like that out West someday.  When I moved out here I was amazed at how many big game animals we have to choose from.  I think we have between ten to twelve big game species to hunt just here in the state of Montana, but elk for me are probably the top of the list simply because of the calling, the interaction you have with them and trying to see if you can win at their game.  Also elk hunting is not for the faint of heart; I love a physical challenge as well as the mental battle in playing that chess game with the animal—elk hunting proved to be perfect for me. 

ARO staff

Wilson: “The first thing I notice about your website is that your whole family is involved.  So how competitive is it living in the same house with four people passionate about the same sport?  Do you have to hear about who go the biggest game animal for a whole year?”

David: “So far I have not had to deal with that because they have not passed me.  My oldest son Warren I think has shot somewhere around sixteen big game animals.  It is not so much competitive because we are all pulling for each other.  As you will see there on the website, even if I am not the shooter, a lot of times I am there running the camera.  I can tell you I am more nervous and pulling more for them to shoot something than I ever am myself.  It is something you cannot put into words as a father.  This is the part of the industry that I guess we do not understand; it is great that you got something on film to use in your next season or series.  But I am fortunate that every one of those archery kills that my son has made, I have been there to capture it on film so that he will be able to go back and look at it forever. 

Wilson: “Wow, what a legacy to leave to your sons!”

David: “Yes it is.  My wife is a full time financial advisor for Edward Jones, and she has a career of her own while still trying to get into the woods as often as she can.  So I am very, very fortunate that my whole family is into it.  Not everyone wants to go as often as I go or to some of the places that I go.  But, everyone is passionate about it at our house.  We are all thinking about elk season the day after it ends.”

 

Wilson: “What do you recommend to get children into archery at a young age, and what can be done to make the sport more appealing to women?

David: “I guess that I have a couple of answers for that.  I pass this along at all my seminars, start them early.  I mean my boys have been shooting since they were two years old.  All I did was go to Walmart or the local department store and bought a kids bow (the kind with the suction cups) and replaced the string with a real string from one of my old bows so that they can nock a real arrow.  This way they can put a real carbon shaft arrow on the string and it will stick in a target—and when they see that arrow sticking in the target, those kids are hooked!  The distance does not have to be long, just a few yards.  Also, take them on hunting trips.  Do not take them on a seven mile hike up the side of a mountain and expect them to do it.  I started with my kids in the pack and carried them up to the top of the mountain.  I think that just showing them what it is like to be outdoors, to hear the animals, they really like it.  Also, I avoided the inclement weather days with them.  You asked about getting women involved, my wife grew up in a hunting family but the women did not do that; it was more for the guys.  So, I just built upon that and started taking her along without the expectation to have to shoot anything right now, just getting her to experience the sights and sounds of the outdoors.  There is a whole lot more to hunting than just killing an animal.  The average person does not know what a grunting elk sounds like or what it is like to see an elk laying upside down with his feet in the air in a wallow—where he suspends his normal sense of security—trying to mask his scent.  I don’t care who they are, when they see that they are going to start to enjoy it and want to be a part of that.”  

 

The Truth 13 DVD

 

Wilson: “I saw it on The Truth 13 DVD and I have also heard you say that the caller and the shooter should not be co-located.  Could you explain to our readers why you want to place the caller and the shooter apart from each other?”

David: “It is a simple one statement answer.  You want to call the elk through you and not to you.  What I mean by that is, when you are trying to call an elk to you then you are not understanding or putting yourself in the situation of that wild animal.  Realize that elk do not walk up to each other and greet by shaking hands with each other.  When an elk responds to a call and he considers himself there, he is often seventy-five, one hundred, or even one hundred fifty yards away.  He lives by his nose, and he only wants to get close enough to recognize who is there.  A lot of time people will call an elk to them and he will be hung up at one hundred yards away and not be able to get him any close and wonder, ‘what did I do wrong?’  You did not do anything wrong, that elk did what he knows he should do.  But if you put your shooter up seventy-five yards forward (and your caller back) now that elk that was hung up at one hundred yards is only twenty-five yards away from the shooter.” 

Wilson: “Now you can close that gap without educating the elk.” 

David: “Right.  Don’t change anything you are doing, just add that partner.  I cannot say this enough, adding that other person does not double your chances, it increases your chance for success exponentially.”

Wilson: “I remember watching the video on your website where the wind changed noticeably when you were hunting those two young bulls.  The grass started to bend to the left from the point of view of the camera, while you were off screen to the right.  Those bulls picked up your scent and you could see their whole expression change drastically—they were out of there!”

David: “That is right.”

 

ARO video metrics

 

Wilson: “Wow, your website is so well done!  You have quite a set up there for “how to” videos.  I really like your metrics for the reviews of gear as well as outfitters.  If Santa Claus is reading this, please consider bringing a Primos bow sling to me this year.  David, did you ever think that you would be so lucky to get to do this for a living?”

David: “Actually no.  It is one of those things that grows year after year.  I got in touch with Primos about nine years ago and started doing seminars for them.  I could not believe that people were asking the guy from Virginia for help, but I immediately realize that a lot of people who had been doing it for a lot more years than I had were still unsuccessful.  I realized that a lot of it was a lack of information, misinformation, or a lack of time to get to these places.  People were afraid of the unknown—not knowing where to go, where to start.  I want to say that the largest downfall in that realm is that a lot of people will talk about calls, even buy one, but when it comes down to using it they will not for the fear that they will run everything else off.  That is the one thing I urge people to do is to use the calls.  Now, no one wants people out there blowing them incorrectly all over the place.  It takes time to learn how to use the call.  I can tell you right now from years of experience that a large part of being able to call those elk, not necessarily to call them in, is to call them so that I can move in closer to get a shot at other elk.”

Wilson: “I have heard you say that you use percussive sounds of items that you find in nature such as pounding rocks on the ground or breaking sticks.  Could you talk more about that?”     

David: “Sure.  I think that the best call on the market on the market is free—banging rocks on the ground.  I have told hundreds of people all throughout my seminars that using rocks is one of the most realistic sounds that you can throw at an animal.  This is a sound that you can use to mimic an elk so that they do not think that you are a bear walking through the woods.  It is all about injecting that realism in there along with a short cow call or muted bugle.  Often that realism in there allows me to see an elk that the average person doesn’t.  That elk may have heard another cow call or bugle from a hunter, but they probably have not heard the sound of hooves [from rocks being pounded on the ground] from a hunter.  That may be what it takes to convince that elk and allow me to get a little bit closer.”

Wilson:  “I think that your website really captures that skill and how to be a better hunter.  I can watch you do a call and practice it myself in my living room in the month of May.”

Wilson: “I noticed that your wife cites her Christian faith in her bio.  I have determined that ethics, hunting or otherwise, is completely ungrounded unless it is based in faith.  How have you been able to enrich your faith from spending so much time in the outdoors?  Do you see a connection between the two?” 

David: “Absolutely.  With all the time I spend in the woods, not so much anymore with the camera crews I am alone, but when you are up on the mountain reflection time is often.  You are constantly looking for that extra guidance.  You are looking at things that are so spectacular that you could not possibly explain them to someone else.  If you cannot look up once and awhile and say ‘thank you,’ then you are missing the whole reason for the creation.  And kind of a humorous point to that is the journal article on my website God likes Elk, which kind of sums up the whole thing.  So the next time you are riding home with your buddy wondering what went wrong, remember you are messing with one of God’s favorite creatures.  He protects them and they get by a lot of time.  The good Lord understands the constitution of the land and He even thinks of you.  It is more remarkable than a blog or even a video can capture.  You just have to realize, that it is not just about the animal.  I think that God really like Montana when he built this place—it does not get any more spectacular than some of the places we choose to hunt.”

Wilson: “Yes, indeed!  Just being out there is part of the sport.  We are very lucky to just get the opportunity to hunt such a beautiful animal in such a beautiful place.”

 

God Likes Elk

 

Wilson: “Here is a question about the mental fortitude necessary for hunting from your journal post God likes Elk, ‘What would you tell hunters to stay motivated when they get up early and go out day after day without any filled game tags to show for it?’”

David: “I did not go into details about our Arizona hunt this year, but it can happen on the first day or the last opportunity on the last day.  I had seven days of hunting planned for that trip.  Arizona is supposed to be that slam dunk draw where you are supposed to get a bull.  There a few things that people should know about that because it is not a slam dunk, it is mostly all public land.  They had not gotten much rain in three months, so they rely on water holes.  I got off the plane September 8th and it began to rain for the entire seven days.  Water holes were everywhere.  We had thunderstorms, roads were so muddy so that you could not get anywhere.”

Wilson: “I bet the animals were all bedded down tight.”

David: “We had no idea that this weather was going to happen.  Someone has to remember that when we carry a camera, we take a lot of our opportunities and flush them down the toilet right there.  You add that extra person to move.  In this particular situation it took until the last 45 minutes on the last day to fill that tag.  We had been chasing this particular herd for two days.  We managed to call one bull to us and fill that tag at 30 yards.  Do not let anyone give you the impression that it is that easy when you see it on TV or the internet.  You are seeing five minutes over five days.  You have to remind yourself that it can happen in an instant, without warning.  It is not uncommon for elk to approach without saying anything.  This is something that I have built my entire elk hunting philosophy on: the day before elk season is the greatest hunting day ever, because in your head is the perfect hunt.  You imagine yourself on a certain hill, the weather is perfect, the wind is in your face—but you have to go out there not expecting to see that.  You learn that it just takes time and experience—and knowing when to back out.  Sometimes the wind is wrong and you have to back out and come back to hunt another day.”  

 

To be continuted . . . click here to read part 2

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